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Headshaker Kingbreaker

Just got told off by somebody in the romance novel community for using the phrase "reverse harem" bc it's "deeply orientalist and stupid“ 😬

How we feeling about this, gang?

Jan 23, 2024, 15:34 · · · Web · 0 · 1

@ludovica tbf, I feel like 'harem' as a genre is like... no other short descriptor describes that exact thing the way that 'harem' does but it does definitely have orientalism mixed into it all... idk it's tricky

@cinnamonandpancakes @ludovica somebody a while back pointed out to me that "harem" is simply a different anglicization of "haram" bc the women's section of the palace was, y'know, forbidden to everyone else. So the entire use of the word in English to mean "bevy of wives" has been orientalist and linguistically nonsense the whole time.

@cinnamonandpancakes @ludovica but then also, I don't feel like "Why Choose?" as a genre name remotely describes the same thing, and I'm not sure what would. :/

@westie @ludovica yeah, it's become a specific jargon word within the romance genre, and changing jargon is hard! I also don't like genre/trope names with question marks but that's purely a nitpick

@westie @cinnamonandpancakes Especially in cDrama fandom, 'harem' is just... accurate. 'Harem dramas' just literally take place in harems :') so the word isn't inherently negative to me, either...

@ludovica @westie clearly the only solution is to retranslate from Chinese and call them 'back palace' dramas :p

@ludovica @westie but I definitely agree that in cdramas at least, the trope is very much not referring to the orientalist idea of a harem, but instead the historical chinese harem

@cinnamonandpancakes @ludovica actually this is probably my favorite suggestion yet

@ludovica @westie in this case reverse harem could be male flower garden... which is kinda a banger

@cinnamonandpancakes @westie this is actually what it's called in a gender reversal transmigration drama with an incredible premise and atrocious execution (Crazy Queen)

@ludovica @westie truly, there are so many epic concepts with terrible execution 😔

@ludovica I wanna know what the better option for that trope is, tho, bc that's a load bearing phrase for describing content.

@ludovica like, I don't disagree that it's got terrible roots but also that trope does have the same problematic root?

@ludovica Hmmm ... Perhaps it depends on your intentions when you use the word. Doesn't Edward Said differentiate between pure and political knowledge? A harem is a word that can be laced with orientalism but "reverse harem" is also simply a term to describe a plot with many men competing for the love of one woman. As such the denotation of the word is not inherently orientalist.

The term only becomes problematic if your use of the term intends to dominate other peoples.

@ludovica Eh I use it all the time and I'm Chinese and live in Asia. Weird.

@ludovica *looks at her profile. Sees that she lives in the US.* Ok that explains everything lol.
Look, most folks in Asia won't care a whit. We admit that we had harems, we watch anime and know that term. Don't let it get you down. Most #CDrama folks are level headed and not as reactive. Enjoy your reverse harems! lol

@liztai thank you! I also never got an answer about how that concept plays into trad wife stuff 🥲

@ludovica well if one wants to be offended by something one will find it 😜 We have a saying in Malaysia - "Rileks je la, bro!" (Bro, just relax)
That's what I will tell people who get upset about these things 😉